# Barriers To Entry, Cathedral Steps - Manchester



## dsankt (Jun 22, 2008)

"Barriers to entry" is a term used within economics to describe the collective obstacles which hinder a firm or individual from entering a market. Within urbex, it effectively means the same. The barriers can be literal - bars, doors, padlocks, fences etc, but could also be a prerequisite skill such as social engineering, smooth talking, climbing or srt. Information is almost always a barrier, whether it's something as simple as knowing which manhole to lift, or as major as knowing the location even exists.





Personally I relish the challenge these barriers create, the higher and greater the obstacles the finer the victory. The hard can makes it good, rewarding. Difficult entry keeps out the vandals, the scrappers, noobs and those weak of spirit. In addition to keeping the vandals and scrappers from the sites we love, should we be protecting the sites from ourselves and the hordes of explorers suffering the 'location of the month' mentality? Difficult entries self-regulate.





The Cathedral Steps is one of those sites - historically interesting, photogenic and well known enough in exploring circles to have massive pulling power. Originally access was limited to those willing to learn a few specific skills, grit their teeth and think a little outside the box. These barriers kept out the tourists and those not willing to put in the hard yards and earn their entry. I am a big believer in earning your keep, ie not forcing in the front door when a second level window is an easy climb.





Not content with the tough entry someone did break a new way in, so the tourists could have a look around at their leisure. Even had this simple entry into the Steps still been available we'd have ignored it, the Steps is a location to be earned. Toughing the hard entry pays respect to UserScott and Stepping Lightly who found an ingenious and daring, yet simple and elegant way to overcome the Step's barriers to entry without breaking anything. Props.



 



 
Quick Groupie - zero, loops, snappel

Teh Otter, Loops and I NOS'd north out of London, intercepting Mr Snap Snap near the steps around 2am. Access was difficult but seriously fun and we found ourselves quickly amongst the arches and chambers of the Cathedral Steps. Since reports and photos litter the internet I focused on shooting a couple of photos and shooting them well so be sure to bust your googlefu if the topic particularly interests you. Photographically I merely scratched the surface of what the Steps can offer but don't get too caught up shooting to miss have a good look around. Enjoy and remember if you're bleeding, gritting your teeth and wincing then you are doing it right.


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## ashless (Jun 22, 2008)

dsankt said:


> Personally I relish the challenge, the higher the barriers and the greater the obstacles the finer the victory. The hard can make it good. Difficult entry keeps out the vandals, the scrappers, noobs and those weak of spirit.



You've got a good point there, was discussing this very situation today with a fellow explorer


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## bungle666 (Jun 22, 2008)

nice pics mate, just one question though.

when i was down there a month or so ago, the sign in your last shot was grimey and full of history, dates and names etc

but it now appears to be clean??!!?? have you "shopped" the pic to clean it up a little??

just wondering mate 

B..


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## rookinella (Jun 22, 2008)

A perfect description of what this site is about I reckon. I love wobbly legs access moments, I personally feel that's what makes this activity so damnnnnn fun. It's a great place and worth all the effort getting in and nice pics too


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## The_Revolution (Jun 22, 2008)

Fantastic pictures; glad you took time with them. Completely agree with what you've written - the satisfaction of a challenging explore and the knowing it'll be a while before someone repeats your achievement is a great feeling.



ashless said:


> You've got a good point there, was discussing this very situation today with a fellow explorer



Hmmm; I suspect that was to do with one of our "self-regulating" sites that will be more challenging now....(good; if only all local sites were that way)


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## Gibbo (Jun 22, 2008)

A good report and photos but lets leave the ethics out of it. Far too many sly digs in your text.


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## crashmatt (Jun 22, 2008)

ashless said:


> You've got a good point there, was discussing this very situation today with a fellow explorer



Yep, the number of newbies tramping through sites and fucking things up for others is quite annoying.


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## thompski (Jun 22, 2008)

Agree with gibbo, many have said its about the buildings.... sounds about right in my opinion.

Good work


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## BigLoada (Jun 22, 2008)

Definitely the best photos I have seen of this place yet. Brilliant.


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## Solo1 (Jun 23, 2008)

This is one of them sites you never tire of viewing , everyone who visits gives it there own photographic slant and interpretation...
P.S those pictures are brilliant !!


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## Bigjobs (Jun 23, 2008)

Great shots, it's a pity the sign got wiped clean though, lots of names and history on that.



> I am a big believer in earning your keep, ie not forcing in the front door when a second level window is an easy climb. I've never broken a door or window.



I totally agree with you there, and have never forced a door or thrown a brick through a window either, but I do believe in using your brain. 

In some places, access can be a nightmare, which makes getting in all the more rewarding, but at some places, it's overthought, when a step back and a rethink can put forward the simplest of answers.


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## dsankt (Jun 23, 2008)

ashless said:


> You've got a good point there, was discussing this very situation today with a fellow explorer



It's been bugging me for a while, not that I'm in any position to tell anyone what to do (and fancy trying to dictate to a bunch of ragtag social misfits exactly how they should trespass), but I think hard access is good. We're EXPLORERS right, isn't doing the hard yards part of the deal? If I may be so arrogant to even mention us in the same paragraph as the following great men but imagine if Hilary parachuted onto the peak of everest and planted his flag? What if Livingstone had a seaplane? What if Neil Armstrong had a freaking teleporter and just beamed himself to the moon? Where is the magnificence in exploring without the hardship, the sacrifices and the challenge?





bungle666 said:


> nice pics mate, just one question though.
> 
> when i was down there a month or so ago, the sign in your last shot was grimey and full of history, dates and names etc
> 
> ...



I haven't shopped it at all, looking at the edges you can see where it's been wiped 'clean'. The caveclan have a lot of drain 'guestbooks' with history going back 20 years and they're a great read.





rookinella said:


> A perfect description of what this site is about I reckon. I love wobbly legs access moments, I personally feel that's what makes this activity so damnnnnn fun. It's a great place and worth all the effort getting in and nice pics too



Right, I'm a problem solver at heart so deciphering tricky access is half the fun of an explore for me. The history holds my interest of course but the experience is the make or break.







The_Revolution said:


> Fantastic pictures; glad you took time with them. Completely agree with what you've written - the satisfaction of a challenging explore and the knowing it'll be a while before someone repeats your achievement is a great feeling.
> 
> Hmmm; I suspect that was to do with one of our "self-regulating" sites that will be more challenging now....(good; if only all local sites were that way)




Others repeating the feat/challengers is great, it's like a pat on the back. When/if I finally meet Scott or Stepping lightly I'll buy em a beer for that entrance, I'm well impressed.






Bigjobs said:


> Great shots, it's a pity the sign got wiped clean though, lots of names and history on that.
> 
> I totally agree with you there, and have never forced a door or thrown a brick through a window either, but I do believe in using your brain.
> 
> In some places, access can be a nightmare, which makes getting in all the more rewarding, but at some places, it's overthought, when a step back and a rethink can put forward the simplest of answers.



I don't want to turn this into an ethics debate, my main point is that hard access is rewarding and has the positive side effect of keeping locations more intact for longer. 



If FNGs have trouble with it because the access is too hard, then find something else and return to the harder stuff later. Imagine someone who'd never done any mountaineering pissing and moaning because Everest is too big or too hard.


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## saul_son (Jun 23, 2008)

Why take the stairs if you can take the lift, when the place you're going to is just the same?


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## Gibbo (Jun 23, 2008)

Ha ha, nice one Saul! Personally I climb the drainpipe of my house onto the roof and climb down the chimney to get into my house at night!

I'd say the important thing is to get in as quickly and quietly as possible. There is no 'right' or 'wrong' way (except breaking in)


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## Solo1 (Jun 23, 2008)

Nothing is fool proof !!


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## dsankt (Jun 23, 2008)

saul_son said:


> Why take the stairs if you can take the lift, when the place you're going to is just the same?



Why climb a mountain when you can rent a helicopter and land on the top?
Why trek through the jungle when you could drive to the other side?
Why cycle across mongolia when you could fly in a comfy plane?

Why explore anything at all, when you can look at photos from an armchair?
Why bother doing anything in life, when you're going to end up dead in a box?

What if the hard way, is the only way?


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## phill.d (Jun 23, 2008)

The beauty of urbex is everyone is in it for different reasons. Some are in it purely for the adrenalin rush and excitement, others just like to look round the place and grab a few snap shots with a compact, some do a real good job of recording it's history, others are purely in it for photography. Whatever reason you do it for there shouldn't be any stereo typical image of what the 'perfect example of an urb exer' is. As long as people behave and don't give the hobby a bad image, I think we should all respect each others motivations and goals, were all in the same rocky boat at the end of the day.


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## saul_son (Jun 23, 2008)

dsankt said:


> What if the hard way, is the only way?



Well obviously the hard way is the only way. 

But the examples you cited don't exactly compare to the short distances you have to cover to access the arches. My question was why take the hard way if there is an easier one? You'd trek through the jungle for the experience of _trekking_ through the jungle, I take it you went primarily to the Cathedral Steps to see them not mess about with the glory of the hard way in?

And the point of my post was that hard or easy, what you get is exactly the same.


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## Gibbo (Jun 23, 2008)

Anyway, does anyone want to have the guts to own up to cleaning the sign?


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## Bigjobs (Jun 23, 2008)

> The beauty of urbex is everyone is in it for different reasons. Some are in it purely for the adrenalin rush and excitement, others just like to look round the place and grab a few snap shots with a compact, some do a real good job of recording it's history, others are purely in it for photography. Whatever reason you do it for there shouldn't be any stereo typical image of what the 'perfect example of an urb exer' is. As long as people behave and don't give the hobby a bad image, I think we should all respect each others motivations and goals, were all in the same rocky boat at the end of the day.



Here Here. 

Dya like my new sig Phil?


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## phill.d (Jun 23, 2008)

Nice one Big Jobs. Hope your doing ok mate


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## dsankt (Jun 24, 2008)

saul_son said:


> Well obviously the hard way is the only way.
> 
> But the examples you cited don't exactly compare to the short distances you have to cover to access the arches. My question was why take the hard way if there is an easier one? You'd trek through the jungle for the experience of _trekking_ through the jungle, I take it you went primarily to the Cathedral Steps to see them not mess about with the glory of the hard way in?
> 
> And the point of my post was that hard or easy, what you get is exactly the same.



I mentioned the exaggerated examples to point out less than subtley that you were suggesting the journey was of no importance, merely the end result of seeing the place. Do you take no pleasure in the journey and simply chase the rewards at the end? I dig the journey, shoot me.

You're incorrect, I went to the steps for both the interesting access I had heard of and to see the steps themselves. I don't know what glory you're talking about, the only glory I see here is due to the people who found the location. I think I've got enough glory stockpiled to keep me going ya know?

Evidently you feel the need to apply your ideals to everyone else. My point is that for people who value the journey, the end result is not exactly the same. Look around and you'll see I'm far from alone. For me the journey/entry is quite a memorable part of the experience, made of it's own hardships, moments of ingenuity and success. If all you're after is the destination that's fine by me, I'm not here to dictate - as if that's even remotely possible given the ragtag anti-authoritarian nature of many within this sub-culture.

I'll take whichever entry/route/journey gives me the most genuine experience.


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## carlosthejackal (Jun 24, 2008)

to be honest,its threads like this that started to break 28dl's back.werent we all noobs once? i totally agree with the comments about pikeys/scrappers etc as they enter with nothing but foul intentions.but simply being a new explorer does not make you disrespectful,a liability or in the same league as those other thieving scum.my first time to cane hill i was warned off as it was a more 'challenging' explore and as i was a 'noob' noone would go with me for fear of me getting us all caught.should i not have bothered?
no i simply went alone.
as yet i havent seen many signs of 'elitism' on this site.
lets keep it that way


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## krela (Jun 24, 2008)

I'd be willing to bet that it's someone who's a member of this or one of the other urbex forums that 'created' the easy entrance though, which isn't good.

I'm not sure where else this debate can go other than descend into arguments, so I'm closing this thread.


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